Forum Home | Getting Involved | Local Life
4 year old girl left to babysit pit bulls
on 2/3/2009 @ 9:42am
|Dad decided to take a nap, mom couldn't wait to get a new tattoo, so that left a 4 year old UP girl to babysit the 2 family pit bulls. The result? Another tragic story in the ongoing saga of families who insist that pit bulls are an appropriate choice for a family pet. Will common sense ever become an element of family decision making?
by Heather on 2/3/2009 @ 11:30am
"The children’s biological mother is deployed in Iraq, Troyer said."
by fredo on 2/3/2009 @ 11:56am
|Heather, you're right I slightly misstated the facts. The issue presented for discussion would be the same.|
by seejane on 2/3/2009 @ 12:06pm
|1. Dang... the father is not quoted a saying "I can't believe this, the dogs have always been so gentle"
2. Stereotypes are based in fact
by ensie on 2/3/2009 @ 1:46pm
|Can we please not rehash the debate over pitbulls? We've already done it previously:
Fredo - You've made your opinion clear on the matter, and are unwilling to bend, even in the face of statistical evidence stating the opposite.
This is a tragic accident and a reminder that young kids should never be left alone with any animals.
by fredo on 2/3/2009 @ 6:59pm
|Pitbull ownership is an ongoing local issue, and one we should never lay to rest. In fairness, I will institute a new policy. Everytime I find an article in the paper about a non pitbull pet attacking a child with such ferocity that the police need to be called I'll start a similar discussion.|
by Crenshaw Sepulveda on 2/3/2009 @ 7:45pm
|I guess then there is no reason to bring up Sarah Palin at this point.|
by chrism39 on 2/3/2009 @ 9:33pm
|There will not be an article in the paper, if it is not a pitbull.|
by chrism39 on 2/3/2009 @ 9:35pm
|And I don't know what you mean when you say pitbull ownership is an ongoing local issue. Breed bans have been found to not work.|
by fredo on 2/3/2009 @ 11:02pm
|Chris, I didn't say that a breed ban was the best solution for this problem. I'm interested in exploring any solutions to this problem and dog owners themselves should make some suggestions.
I don't object to adults owning a pitbull when there are no minor children in the household. When little kids are exposed it seems to me that it's just a triumph of selfishness over parental instinct.
by fredo on 2/4/2009 @ 10:18am
|Maybe I should have added "chalk art" to the subject line.|
by chrism39 on 2/4/2009 @ 7:46pm
|Good one fredo! There does at times seem to be a lack of relevant discussion topics, but a plethera of notices that this place is closing or well boring stuff, their I said it.|
by NineInchNachos on 2/4/2009 @ 8:09pm
|has anybody seen the woman's tattoo? I mean it could be really awesome. |
by NineInchNachos on 2/4/2009 @ 8:15pm
by NineInchNachos on 2/4/2009 @ 8:22pm
|you know why this thread is crap? because people are tired of always focusing on the negative aspects of pit bull attacks. Almost nobody EVER in the liberal media EVER mentions the positive side of pit bull attacks.
It just makes me sick... sicker that you would feel after looking at all those tattoo pics I just posted.
that is all.
by fredo on 2/4/2009 @ 8:29pm
|Well, for all the turmoil that her absence occasioned I certainly hope so. I would also be interested in the costs which will accrue to the local taxpayers. These might include placement costs for the children through DSHS, hospital costs for the little tyke, perhaps a flight home from Iraq for the real mother, etc.
NIN your tattoo pictures were awsome. I can always count on you for some quality illustrations for my postings.
by Heather on 2/5/2009 @ 10:15am
|I think there are valid reasons that no one wanted to get involved in this discussion in this venue.
This was a serious incident. A little girl was hurt. Those young kids are probably left without supervision on a regular basis. Mom is in Iraq. Too many parents are in Iraq. Too many kids are left unsupervised. Too many dogs are mistrained or mistreated.
Often, on these threads, serious comments are mocked and the thread is turned into a three ring circus. This diminishes the seriousness of the incident and demoralizes the commentor. Some of us have just decided to stay out of it. I'm not sure why I decided to jump in this time.
by scout on 2/5/2009 @ 11:17am
|Heather, I agree and would add that people also frequently hide behind sarcastic/mocking statements regarding serious issues and therefore never really voice what their real opinion is - sort of like an arsonist that stands back and watches the fire from the sidelines. |
It's juvenile, gets old quickly, and makes me not want to participate....JMHO
by fredo on 2/5/2009 @ 11:55am
|Most blog threads regarding serious topics are interlaced with humorous postings. This doesn't diminish whatsoever their ability to stimulate a lively, even provocative discussion.
Most parents would agree that leaving a loaded gun on the kitchen table was an irresponsible act. However, many wouldn't hesitate to bring a frequently vicious breed of animal right into the home and treat it like a family member. Does every pit bull cause a problem, certainly not. But society need a solution to this recurrent problem. Pit bull owners please respond. How can we protect the children who are being placed in harms way?
Those readers who want to see only serious discussions of topics will not find it at feedTacoma. Try Sewingwithnancy.com
by chrism39 on 2/5/2009 @ 12:51pm
|I do not only want to see serious discussion topics, but I grow tired of the postings about how this place is closing or this place got a remodel, I don't care.
There are many reasons why pitbulls can become vicious, not spaying or nutering, keeping them confined outside, mistreating them, but to compare pitbulls to a loaded gun is a little bit of a stretch. Pitbulls are known for dog aggression much more than people. You have your ming made up and I don't think it can be altered, which is fine, don't get a pitbull. my pitbull is very good with my children and has never so much as even growled. my friend with a weiner dog however has had her children bit several times.
by fredo on 2/5/2009 @ 7:23pm
|"comparing pitbulls to a loaded gun is a little bit of a stretch."
Annual emergency room visits by instrumentality (US Center for Disease control)
Gun shot accidents !00,000 (1999)
Dog bites 268,000(2001)
by guttaguttamd92 on 3/18/2009 @ 6:30pm
|little girl shouldnt have been fuckin with them|
by chrism39 on 3/18/2009 @ 9:14pm
|I hope your messages are meant to be taken as a joke. I love pitbulls, but a child should always be allowed to as you say 'fuck' with them and not get hurt.
Because we have a dog that comes from a dangerous type of breed I never leave my children alone with our dog. That said, my children have tugged on her, jumped on her laid on her and chased her and she has never even growled. A child is more important than any dog. I have also decided to never get another pitbull, the publics hatred ( while warranted) has about done me in. We're getting a bulldog next time around, everyone loves a bulldog.
by Maria on 3/19/2009 @ 11:21am
|I don't think pit bulls in general have a tendency towards hurting people any more than another large, active dog breed.
I do think they are a high-maintenance dog, and like all dogs, especially breeds that were used for hunting or finding small animals, should never be left alone with children. Irresponsible owners and poor training are the biggest factor in this case, and in most cases.
If anyone has the stamina to read a long, scholarly article about this, Malcolm Gladwell wrote a really good piece for the New Yorker back in 2006.
One very interesting point he makes, based on a 1991 study in Denver, is that in many cases where dogs kill humans, there is a commonality among those dog owners:
The strongest connection of all, though, is between the trait of dog viciousness and certain kinds of dog owners. In about a quarter of fatal dog-bite cases, the dog owners were previously involved in illegal fighting. The dogs that bite people are, in many cases, socially isolated because their owners are socially isolated, and they are vicious because they have owners who want a vicious dog.
Section 5 is especially insightful, and ends with this comment by an A.S.P.C.A. staff member and dog bite expert:
"A fatal dog attack is not just a dog bite by a big or aggressive dog," Lockwood went on. "It is usually a perfect storm of bad human-canine interactions—the wrong dog, the wrong background, the wrong history in the hands of the wrong person in the wrong environmental situation. I've been involved in many legal cases involving fatal dog attacks, and, certainly, it's my impression that these are generally cases where everyone is to blame. You've got the unsupervised three-year-old child wandering in the neighborhood killed by a starved, abused dog owned by the dogfighting boyfriend of some woman who doesn't know where her child is. It's not old Shep sleeping by the fire who suddenly goes bonkers. Usually there are all kinds of other warning signs."
Section 3 also has some interesting info on how pit bulls were bred selectively to NOT be aggressive towards humans.
by chrism39 on 3/19/2009 @ 6:44pm
|So good thanks.|
by ensie on 4/8/2009 @ 11:17am
|An interesting post on the topic of reporting dog bites:
by fredo on 4/8/2009 @ 11:32am
|Ensie-I enjoyed your link. I suppose the people in the emergency room were faced with an unusual choice. Was the woman's death related to a dog bite or to a gardening accident as originally claimed? The bite certainly wasn't the serious type that vicious dogs usually are associated with, but the dog's saliva seems to have been infused with some sort of bat-like anticoagulant. Strange but interesting. Thanks for the posting.|
by Ken Foster on 4/8/2009 @ 5:51pm
|What's remarkable is that Fredo clicked on the link, but didn't read the actual article. She didn't bleed to death. The headline said she was bite by a Rottweiler. She was not. It also suggested she died from blood loss, but she died of an infection. But the fact that you walked away from my post thinking that it was indeed a death by dog bite just goes to show how much you and others "learn" by skimming inaccurate headlines.
Here are some more stories you probably didn't hear about:
by fredo on 4/8/2009 @ 7:09pm
|Ken- I reread the story. The lady was bitten by a dog, then she died. The autopsy report wasn't provided. My comment was intended to punch up a pretty routine story.
You might be interested to know that dog bites are a leading cause of emergency room visits, far more frequent than gunshot wounds.
by ensie on 4/8/2009 @ 7:35pm
|Wow Ken! Thanks so much for commenting. I am a huge fan of your books as well as your work with dogs, especially pit bulls. Please give Brando, Sula, and Zephyr a snuggle from me, as I'm also a big fan of them.
And Fredo - You might be interested to know that Ken is a tireless worker on behalf of dogs everywhere. He is an accomplished author and runs the Sula Foundation, an organization "dedicated to fostering responsible pit bull ownership through low-cost veterinary clinics, education and advocacy".
by fredo on 4/8/2009 @ 7:44pm
|Ken Foster is aces with me!
I'm prepared to proclaim him " a leading advocate of responsible pit bull ownership."
by chrism39 on 4/9/2009 @ 8:07am
|I love that guy, I read his book and just loved it. What about me Fredo? I'm a responsible pitbull owner.|
by fredo on 4/9/2009 @ 8:24am
|Chrism@ You've always been aces with me.
But my position is that pit bull owners who are also raising children are irresponsible by definition. There is no way you could effectively prevent the mauling of a child and your child's welfare is job one.
by Ken Foster on 4/9/2009 @ 10:24am
|I think you can raise a pit bull and a child responsibly, but that doesn't include leaving a child unsupervised with a dog. Any dog. A few years ago a girl in New York was strangled by a golden retreiver that grabbed her scarf and wouldn't let go. The dog wasn't evil, and certainly the girl wasn't at fault. But if there'd been a parent around, they'd both be alive today.|
by fredo on 8/18/2009 @ 7:18pm
|Skagit County Washington@
A 9 month old girl was mauled twice in 2 days by Grandma's pet pit bull mix family dog. The toddler then spent 9 days in the hospital with a skull fracture and wounds to the face. Is this the kind of Grandma you remember from your childhood?
by fredo on 7/13/2010 @ 8:05am
|These pitbull stories are in the news all the time but this one seemed to illustrate just how vicious a "family" pit bull can be:
by The Jinxmedic on 7/13/2010 @ 8:26am
|That deputy deserves a medal.|
Remember, Washington State is a "shall issue" concealed pistol permit state, I highly recommend anyone who is out in the city alone to first get proper training, and then get the permit. Use your pepper spray on the muggers, but use the firearm on the pit bulls. From personal experience, I discovered the hard way that pepper spray DOES NOT WORK ON RAMPAGING PIT BULLS. (Ask me in person sometime about my time as a paramedic in Pennsylvania, and what I REALLY think of these beasts.)
"But they are such nice dogs!" I call BS on that. A responsible owner can indeed have "nice pit bulls" as long as he or she has direct supervision of them- however, all pit bulls are ticking time bombs, and once loose on the street, they should be hunted down and killed as a public service.
Therefore, I wholeheartedly endorse this product: i.feedtacoma.com/NineInchNachos/pitbull-...
For the record, I love dogs. Pit Bulls (and every variation thereof) are not dogs.
by fredo on 7/13/2010 @ 8:39am
|jinx, I never leave home without my Pitbull HLK. thanks for the link.|
by Jesse on 7/13/2010 @ 5:01pm
|I agree with Fredo. |
I'd also like to add that anyone with small children or a frail adult in their home with a Pit Bull should be tried in court on stupidity charges and attempted murder if the dog attacks said people.
That goes for any aggressive breed.
by homewithmybabies on 8/1/2010 @ 12:38am
|I AM SHOCKED TO SEE THAT MORE PEOPLE CARED MORE ABOUT THE DOGS THEN THE CHILDREN'S SAFETY OR GETTING THE MOM BACK WITH HER CHILDREN. I AM GLAD TO SAY THAT THE CHILDREN ARE OK AND HAVE HAD ME THEIR MOM HOME FROM IRAQ FOR OVER 6 MONTHS NOW AND I WILL ALWAYS DO EVERYTHING FOR MY BABIES!!!!!|
by ann012 on 9/20/2010 @ 5:08pm
|YOU KNOW AS AN OWNER OF SEVERAL PITBULLS. I HAVE NEVER SEEN ONE OF MY PIT BULLS ATTACK ANYONE NOT EVEN A BABY. IT MAKES ME DISGUSTED TO HEAR ALL THE TIME HOW PEOPLE THINK PITBULLS ARE SO DAMN VICIOUS BUT NOBODY STOPS TO THINK ABOUT THE OWNERS WHO ARE TEACHING THOSE DOGS TO BE LIKE THAT. IT IS STATED THAT PITBULLS ARE THE MOST LOVING AND CARING ANIMALS AND ARE LESS LIKELY TO ATTACK THAN A CHIHUAHA IS. NOW IF YOU ASK ME I'M ALOT MORE SCARED OF CHIHUAHUAS THAN I AM OF PITS. THE MEDIA DOESNT CARE IF A CHIHUAHUA OR A LAB ATTACKS, NO BUT WHENS ITS A PIT THATS A WHOLE DIFFERENT STORY. NOW IN REGARDS TO THESE STUPID ASS PARENTS WHO LEFT A 4 YEAR OLD ALONE WITH 2 DOGS WAS A STUPID IDEA BUT NOT ON THE PITBULLS PART BUT ON THE PARENTS, WHAT KIND OF PARENTS ARE GONNA LEAVE THEIR CHILD ALONE ESPECIALLY AT THAT AGE. I'M SRY BUT I WILL FIGHT FOR PITBULLS RIGHTS AND I HOPE TO GOD THAT EVERYONE OUT THERE THAT ABUSES AND FIGHTS PITBULLS IS PUNISHED BECAUSE THESE DOGS ARE AMAZING AND I WILL NEVER OWN A DIFFERENT BREED. PITBULLS NEED HOMES TOO AND IF YOU TRAIN UR DOG RIGHT HE WILL NEVER ATTACK.|
by ann012 on 9/20/2010 @ 5:12pm
|TO "THE JINXMEDIC" PITBULLS ARE DOGS TOO AND THEY HAVE FEELINGS AND I DISAGREE THAT THEY SHOULD BE HUNTED AND KILLED, YOU KNOW YOU CAN GO TO JAIL IF YOU DO THAT IT IS STILL A CRIME TO KILL AN ANIMAL. ALL DOGS NEED LOVE TOO. ESPECIALLY PIT BULLS. IT ONLY TAKES ONE PERSON TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE FOR THESE DOGS. SO IF YOU OWN A PIT N U WOULD DO ANYTHING IN THE WORLD TO KEEP UR DOG, PLZ SPEAK OUT AGAINST PPL LIKE "THE JINXMEDIC"|
by fredo on 9/20/2010 @ 5:33pm
|your pitbulls may be the nicest pitbulls on earth but they seem to have had an adverse affect on your ability to recognize that your cap-lock function is turned on.|
by L.S.Erhardt on 9/20/2010 @ 5:44pm
|Why is there so much drama over pit bulls? You never hear this about Schnauzers or Bassett Hounds.|
by fredo on 9/20/2010 @ 5:51pm
|re: the propensity of chihuahuas to attack: the first chihauhau that places his teeth into my flesh has just used them for the last time.|
by L.S.Erhardt on 9/20/2010 @ 6:37pm
|Honestly, any dog that bites me better run like hell afterwards.|
Otherwise, I'll be walking into the ER with a freshly strangled/bludgeoned dog still dangling from my arm.
I'm a lover, not a fighter. But if my physical well being is being compromised, I'll do what needs to be done. Without chickening out (I hope).
by NineInchNachos on 9/20/2010 @ 8:08pm
|friend of ours tells a story of a sad neighbor who brought home a baby pit bull puppy only to watch it get killed by the older pit bull when the puppy got to close to his food dish.|
by The Jinxmedic on 9/21/2010 @ 2:40pm
|"PLZ SPEAK OUT AGAINST PPL LIKE "THE JINXMEDIC" "
Yup, I'm pretty bad, all right. Maybe more people should PLZ SPEAK OUT AGAINST PPL IN ALL CAPZ BCAUSE IT MAKES UR CAUSE MUR STRNGLY AND MAKEZ U LOOK SMRTR!!!1!!11!!!!
by NineInchNachos on 9/21/2010 @ 3:32pm
|ha! ur so mean.|
by The Jinxmedic on 9/21/2010 @ 3:39pm
|I HZ CHEEZBRGR, 2 !!!!1!1!!|
by NineInchNachos on 9/23/2010 @ 3:32pm
|"She turned, the animal leaped, and locked its jaws onto her face."
by fredo on 9/23/2010 @ 3:39pm
|Another lead for one of your Lobotomy devices. I'll be anxious to hear what
has to say about this.
by The Jinxmedic on 9/23/2010 @ 3:59pm
|"THE JINXMEDIC" is not allowed to comment, because you are supposed to PLZ SPEAK OUT AGAINST PPL LIKE "THE JINXMEDIC" because, I'm like not nice and stuff, and I don't yell at people in all caps with poor grammar and silly text-speak. But pit bulls are apparently okay, no matter how many faces these "playful" and "harmless" dogs rip off of people. (Remember, those quotes are taken straight from the owner as quoted in the latest article).|
Yes, ann012, Chihuahuas probably bite more people than pit bulls- but seriously- when is the last time you heard of a Chihuahua ripping someone's face off? Or killing someone? Let's put this in the context of other types of dangerous weapons- What's worse, a welt from a BB gun, or multiple rounds from a 12 gauge shotgun loaded with double-0 buckshot? I'lll take a bite from the BB gun any day, thank you.
by daubermaus on 9/23/2010 @ 4:26pm
|Does that mean I can have a chihuahua?????|
by The Jinxmedic on 9/23/2010 @ 4:33pm
|No. I don't like BB gun welts, either.|
by NineInchNachos on 9/23/2010 @ 5:02pm
there is a new danger in the world ZOMBIE PITBULLS
".. told investigators the 2-year-old dog bit his 9-year-old daughter Aug. 15. Sexton told authorities he felt the dog should be put down, so he grabbed a kitchen knife and tried to cut its throat.
When that failed, Sexton told deputies he used the chainsaw."
by fredo on 9/23/2010 @ 5:21pm
|THE JINXMEDIC AKA SEXTON|
by Mofo from the Hood on 9/23/2010 @ 9:15pm
by fredo on 9/30/2010 @ 8:00am
|Dateline: Federal Way, Washington
"Police spokeswoman Cathy Schrock says a 13-year-old boy was bitten on the arm and backside by the pack of dogs near a playground. He was treated at a hospital".
Read more: www.thenewstribune.com/2010/09/30/136269...
These pitbulls can't seem to stay out of the news.
by NineInchNachos on 9/30/2010 @ 8:11am
|stop these senseless biting and police shoots dog incidents. Send away for your home lobotomy kit today. The blood flowing in the streets must stop! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!|
by fredo on 9/30/2010 @ 8:14am
|I'm ordering some more today for all the pitbull owners on my Xmas gift list.|
by The Jinxmedic on 9/30/2010 @ 8:15am
|Is the Magnum Hole Shooter (TM) included in the PBHLK, or is that an optional accessory?|
by fredo on 9/30/2010 @ 8:20am
|Here at Fredo City we keep one in the office which residents can check out. Unfortunately, the need frequently arises after hours so I recommend each resident own one of their own. And yes, the Magnum Hole Shooter is nice accessory, some of the dogs object to the proceedure.|
by fredo on 11/8/2010 @ 10:42pm
|RR you need to get your east coast distributor for the lobotomy device on top of this situation right away:
Authorities in North Carolina say a 2-year-old boy was mauled by his grandmother's five pit bulls and is in critical condition. Seattle Times 11/8/10
by NineInchNachos on 11/8/2010 @ 11:04pm
by The Jinxmedic on 11/9/2010 @ 1:36pm
|What is it with pit bull owners that transcend all reality? Case in point: 84 year old Missouri pastor found inside pit bull pen, mauled to death in a manner consistent with an animal attack. Son blames a mountain lion, or stray dogs that somehow got into the pen, killed the pastor, and then left. Son maintains that it couldn't possibly have been the pit bulls in the pen, as they were his dad's "best buddies". I kid you not. Link:
by L.S.Erhardt on 11/9/2010 @ 2:53pm
|Blame the breed, not the owner?|
by The Jinxmedic on 11/9/2010 @ 3:10pm